# Forum Mathematics Sigma and Pi - have they been successful?

1. Top Mathematician
kmea

Forum Mathematics Sigma and Pi are officially 10 years old now. Have they been a success? On this forum, these journals are some of the most hotly debated.

These new journals, championed by Gowers and Tao tried to significantly reduce the cost of publishing, however they also decided to use a different model, and pass the publishing charges onto the authors instead of the readers (e.g. institutions, libraries, etc). Currently the article processing charges are 1500 USD per article.

What do you think? Are these journals high quality? Does their business model make sense long term? Are they good to have on your resume? Do hiring committees care?

1 weekkmea
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2. Top Mathematician
kibx

Wow, 10 years? No, definitely have not lived up to their self-made hype then. I thought they started 3 years ago or something.

1 weekkibx
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3. Top Mathematician
wxob

Forum Mathematics Sigma and Pi are officially 10 years old now. Have they been a success? On this forum, these journals are some of the most hotly debated.

These new journals, championed by Gowers and Tao tried to significantly reduce the cost of publishing, however they also decided to use a different model, and pass the publishing charges onto the authors instead of the readers (e.g. institutions, libraries, etc). Currently the article processing charges are 1500 USD per article.

What do you think? Are these journals high quality? Does their business model make sense long term? Are they good to have on your resume? Do hiring committees care?

There's definitely stuff in these journals which I find very interesting. But it's usually by people who are close to the Gowers-Tao mafia already.

I'm not senior enough to have any ideas how this has impacted hiring committees. The business model definitely comes across as extremely problematic to me though: it disincentivizes submissions from people without grants, or people in lower-income countries. I know there's supposed to be some fee waiver for such folks, but I'm sure there's a chilling effect the fee has on submissions.

1 weekwxob
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4. Top Mathematician
doec

They're not a negative on a resume, but I've never seen someone make a big deal out of either of them when hyping a job candidate. Given that Pi is claimed to be as good as the top 5 (which are constantly cited in hiring meetings), this leads me to think that they have not succeeded.

My institution apparently has a deal where they'll waive the article processing fees, but the whole idea is repugnant to me, so there is no way I'd ever submit to either of them. I've also declined all refereeing requests for them up to now, though that's not a hard and fast personal rule and I would probably referee a paper for a junior author for them.

1 weekdoec
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5. Top Mathematician
biao

The first time I heard of them was on MJR

1 weekbiao
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6. Top Mathematician
lslr

Their model (with the article processing charges) is clearly problematic. Mathematicians criticize the MDPI journals as being predatory, and I honestly don't see how the Forum of mathematics Sigma/Pi journal is any different from that.

1 weeklslr
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7. Top Mathematician
qsuq

Their model (with the article processing charges) is clearly problematic. Mathematicians criticize the MDPI journals as being predatory, and I honestly don't see how the Forum of mathematics Sigma/Pi journal is any different from that.

They have real refereeing, real editing, etc. What makes MDPI crap is not it's publishing model per se, rather it's complete lack of seriousness and professionalism - they accept anything and everything after a week in spite of bad referee reports.

1 weekqsuq
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8. Top Mathematician
bgew

Their model (with the article processing charges) is clearly problematic. Mathematicians criticize the MDPI journals as being predatory, and I honestly don't see how the Forum of mathematics Sigma/Pi journal is any different from that.

They have real refereeing, real editing, etc. What makes MDPI crap is not it's publishing model per se, rather it's complete lack of seriousness and professionalism - they accept anything and everything after a week in spite of bad referee reports.

Some MDPI journals have real refereeing, and all of them are supported by professional editing. Examples of good MDPI journals:

Remote Sensing Atmosphere Sustainability Fluids

MDPI Remote Sensing has impact factor = 5.3, same as Annals Math.

1 weekbgew
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9. Top Mathematician
phof

MDPI Remote Sensing has impact factor = 5.3, same as Annals Math.

How is that evidence of quality or even reliability?!

1 weekphof
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10. Top Mathematician
fpwa

two clown journals

1 weekfpwa
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11. Top Mathematician
nlfa
[...]

They have real refereeing, real editing, etc. What makes MDPI crap is not it's publishing model per se, rather it's complete lack of seriousness and professionalism - they accept anything and everything after a week in spite of bad referee reports.

Some MDPI journals have real refereeing, and all of them are supported by professional editing. Examples of good MDPI journals:

Remote Sensing Atmosphere Sustainability Fluids

MDPI Remote Sensing has impact factor = 5.3, same as Annals Math.

Sorry this is nonsense. I agreed to referee for several of them just to see how they operated. I rejected articles that were at the level of undergrad exercises and they were pro only published a few days later. This was in Mathematics and Symmetry. Complete cons. Anyone involved with them should be ashamed of themselves.

1 weeknlfa
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12. Top Mathematician
motj
[...]

Some MDPI journals have real refereeing, and all of them are supported by professional editing. Examples of good MDPI journals:

Remote Sensing Atmosphere Sustainability Fluids

MDPI Remote Sensing has impact factor = 5.3, same as Annals Math.

Sorry this is nonsense. I agreed to referee for several of them just to see how they operated. I rejected articles that were at the level of undergrad exercises and they were pro only published a few days later. This was in Mathematics and Symmetry. Complete cons. Anyone involved with them should be ashamed of themselves.

This thread is suppose to be about Forum Mathematics Sigma and Pi, not the con-artist journal MDPI. Lets stay on topic.

1 weekmotj
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13. Top Mathematician
rlep

lmao I didn't know you need to pay to publish there, and there's no way I can afford the 1500usd just to publish there.

1 weekrlep
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14. Top Mathematician
ibys

I think Elsevier and Springer are bad, but I also don't like the pay to publish model. I like the idea of diamond open access journals like CAMS, Discrete Analysis, and Ars Inveniendi Analytica, but I guess they need some external financial support to be viable.

1 weekibys
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15. Top Mathematician
cvxy

Given that they waive fees for the US and essentially everywhere except the EU, where there is typically univeristy money for open-access publishing, it’s EU taxpayers funding their whole project. Pretty rich given that Tao is an American multimillionaire, and neither he nor Gowers pay EU taxes.

1 weekcvxy
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16. Top Mathematician
vjni

The lemons like Tao support the journals

1 weekvjni
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17. Top Mathematician
mtnv

Given that they waive fees for the US and essentially everywhere except the EU, where there is typically univeristy money for open-access publishing, it’s EU taxpayers funding their whole project. Pretty rich given that Tao is an American multimillionaire, and neither he nor Gowers pay EU taxes.

They waive fees for US authors? Why?

1 weekmtnv
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18. Top Mathematician
xfeh

Given that they waive fees for the US and essentially everywhere except the EU, where there is typically univeristy money for open-access publishing, it’s EU taxpayers funding their whole project. Pretty rich given that Tao is an American multimillionaire, and neither he nor Gowers pay EU taxes.

How do you know that? The US fees may be covered by someone else in the US. It's not like a waiver makes administrative costs disappear...

1 weekxfeh
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19. Top Mathematician
lisr

Given that they waive fees for the US and essentially everywhere except the EU, where there is typically univeristy money for open-access publishing, it’s EU taxpayers funding their whole project. Pretty rich given that Tao is an American multimillionaire, and neither he nor Gowers pay EU taxes.

and they are published by an UK university press which is not in Eurozone anymore. Ridiculous

1 weeklisr
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20. Top Mathematician
biao

TT made a big mistake to publish there, which gave the journal its current reputation: a place that some big shoots want to promote for some shady reasons. Add that to the fact that they have publication fees, this doesn't look right...

1 weekbiao
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